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I'm not. Existing law isn't a "belief". It's a real fact, which is what they will be teaching. Alongside that safety isn't a "belief", it's a quantifiable set of practices that reduce injuries and fatality.

I believe you might be the one confusing the two. And when a mild regulation passes, with a single nay vote during it's entire journey, in one of the reddest states in the Union, you have to wonder what belief system considers it indoctrination.
 

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No it’s not. I work in this area every single day of my life. This is such an over-dramatization of reality.

Driving an ATV isn’t probable cause. Never has been, never will be. The only reason anyone will have to worry about this is if they are breaking another law, and if so, I couldn’t care less if they get another $150 citation tacked on because they were lazy and entitled to not take a 15 minute free online course the law required.
I'm not. Existing law isn't a "belief". It's a real fact, which is what they will be teaching. Alongside that safety isn't a "belief", it's a quantifiable ideas that reduce injuries and fatality.

I believe you might be the one confusing the two. And when a mild regulation passes, with a single nay vote during it's entire journey, in one of the reddest states in the Union, you have to wonder what belief system considers it indoctrination.
I don’t need laws to tell me to be a good person,
Usually people that have a hard time making decisions for themselves need to be told what to do..
I am well aware of where I stand…
 

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I'm personally judging your ideas you share in public. Haven't judged anything about your character in this thread. I've largely ignored others expressing their criticisms of the law but your statement about probable cause isn't a simple opinion and the idea it's indoctrination can be judged by it's definition and the history of the term (we know you are using it in the pejorative sense most of us are familiar with).

And law isn't about your individual character. It's about defining the minimum boundaries to protect other citizens and the functioning of society. In this case they require 15 minutes of your time to legally drive an ATV on public roads. It's a privilege they get to regulate and in this case a bipartisan group of our representatives decided this was the right balance of practices to set into law.

You could have voiced your disapproval this spring when it was being debated.

And you still always have the free will to ignore the lawful requirements and behave as you wish. There are potential consequences to that choice though.
 

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Vanilla,

What are the limitations on an officer (state or federal LEO) interacting with riders without an official "pullover"? Can they ask to see your certificate and do anything if you refuse?

I've never thought about it in the past as it's never occurred to me in any fashion. And our FPO ride alongs were always educational and not punitive enforcement, though they would collect information if a law was being broken.
 

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I'm personally judging your ideas you share in public. Haven't judged anything about your character in this thread. I've largely ignored others expressing their criticisms of the law but your statement about probable cause isn't a simple opinion and the idea it's indoctrination can be judged by it's definition and the history of the term (we know you are using it in the pejorative sense most of us are familiar with).

And law isn't about your individual character. It's about defining the minimum boundaries to protect other citizens and the functioning of society. In this case they require 15 minutes of your time to legally drive an ATV on public roads. It's a privilege they get to regulate and in this case a bipartisan group of our representatives decided this was the right balance of practices to set into law.

You could have voiced your disapproval this spring when it was being debated.

And you still always have the free will to ignore the lawful requirements and behave as you wish. There are potential consequences to that choice though.
I'm personally judging your ideas you share in public. Haven't judged anything about your character in this thread. I've largely ignored others expressing their criticisms of the law but your statement about probable cause isn't a simple opinion and the idea it's indoctrination can be judged by it's definition and the history of the term (we know you are using it in the pejorative sense most of us are familiar with).

And law isn't about your individual character. It's about defining the minimum boundaries to protect other citizens and the functioning of society. In this case they require 15 minutes of your time to legally drive an ATV on public roads. It's a privilege they get to regulate and in this case a bipartisan group of our representatives decided this was the right balance of practices to set into law.

You could have voiced your disapproval this spring when it was being debated.

And you still always have the free will to ignore the lawful requirements and behave as you wish. There are potential consequences to that choice though.
You can Judge my comments, actions, finances, lifestyle, religion, or hair color all you want.. You will STILL never convince me that I need 15 more minutes of “education” to protect others on a dirt road…

Remember that the next time your speedometer breaks the speed limit even 1 mph over. The law is the law right? It’s there to keep us safe! Because I need my government constantly in my affairs, I need the government to tell me to put my seatbelt on, I need the government to tell me to wear a mask so I’m safe, I need the government to tell me to not run someone off the dirt road with my ATV so I can be safe..
I refuse to be the frog boiling alive in a pot of water (the world) where “ indoctrination” is so widely excepted as “education“
Oh, a scientist told me so!
Oh, a Lawyer told me so!
Oh, the Government told me so!
Oh, my Bishop told me so!
I’m so sick and tired of complacency, nobody questioning anything, multiply that by 80 years of propaganda and you’ve got Goosefreak wound up about indoctrination….

But, I’ll stand by it… I’ll stand real tall right next to it!
 

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Best of luck with that worldview. I can't think of a single experiment in governance that would satisfy your individualistic philosophy.

Glad the most citizens are willing to be slightly inconvenienced in regards to these issues.

*PS: when you have the interest to educate yourself you can read up on how real life government isn't catered exclusively to the individual. Governments are tasked with also dealing with population level realities, like accidents and fatalities on public roads (or novel virus mitigation). Any philosophy that doesn't accept that reality is a fairytale. And if you already understand that then your second paragraph has an obvious flaw.
 

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Best of luck with that worldview. I can't think of a single experiment in governance that would satisfy your individualistic philosophy.

Glad the most citizens are willing to be slightly inconvenienced in regards to these issues.

*PS: when you have the interest to educate yourself you can read up on how real life government isn't catered exclusively to the individual. Governments are tasked with also dealing with population level realities, like accidents and fatalities on public roads (or novel virus mitigation). Any philosophy that doesn't accept that reality is a fairytale. And if you already understand that then your second paragraph has an obvious flaw.
Okay, Thanks!
I’ll just take your word for it….! Backcountry has SPOKEN!
 

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Marijuana businesses were deemed “essential” employees from the beginning in your great state.

But back to this new law: it’s actually not an excuse to violate someone’s 4th amendment rights. Just like an officer can’t simply stop any car on the road to check to see if that person has their driver license in their possession, LEOs will not be able to stop off-road vehicle drivers just to check on this. If they have you stopped for another purpose they can certainly check on this, but they’ll still need reasonable suspicion to stop you for a crime before they can check on this.

If you can’t do 15 minutes, but feel you have the right to go out and tear up public lands at will, I have to wonder just how entitled those people are. They going to be asking for the government to buy their gas for their ATV this year too?
Hey Vanilla, that already happened with the $600 stimulus checks!
 

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Feel free to show me where my claims where wrong.
There’s that “ I’m not done arguing” comment!

Backcountry, if I remember right, you were scared $hitless during Covid, wore a mask and all that and you probably raced out and got shot up four times with the Vax too hu?? In spite of all of the doctors and scientist basically coming out and saying it’s bull$hit!!

I was literally sitting on the $hitter 5 minutes ago and it just hit me about our Covid argument, almost forgot. That’s what your opinions mean to me. A “$hitter” thought!

This argument chain makes more sense to me now..

And to your dismay, I am not retracting any of my previous comments…

Aside from the Military
The Government can lick my S A C K
 

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There’s that “ I’m not done arguing” comment!

Backcountry, if I remember right, you were scared $hitless during Covid, wore a mask and all that and you probably raced out and got shot up four times with the Vax too hu?? In spite of all of the doctors and scientist basically coming out and saying it’s bull$hit!!

I was literally sitting on the $hitter 5 minutes ago and it just hit me about our Covid argument, almost forgot. That’s what your opinions mean to me. A “$hitter” thought!

This argument chain makes more sense to me now..

And to your dismay, I am not retracting any of my previous comments…

Aside from the Military
The Government can lick my S A C K
Most people don't think about others when they are on the crapper. Odd revelation. 🤔

I don't care if you retract. I just expect people to be able the defend their ideas rationally.

And I did spend a lot of time protecting my MIL & my household from Covid from 3/2020 to 3/2022. I'd do it again. My wife got to hold her mother's hand while she peacefully died one morning instead of being separated from her as she died alone in a hospital from Covid (her doctors prediction given most people with ALS & dementia die of respiratory failure). We got our baby girl born without incident and thru her first autumn/winter flu/Covid season without incident, no small feat for a premie born to "geriatric" parents. We still have N95s for peaks locally and at my wife's work.

But none of that has anything to do with the dual tasks governments face. Or why one of the most conservative states in the Union saw it fit to pace a basic education course for ATVs. It's a deflection.
 

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Most people don't think about others when they are on the crapper. Odd revelation. 🤔

I don't care if you retract. I just expect people to be able the defend their ideas rationally.

And I did spend a lot of time protecting my MIL & my household from Covid from 3/2020 to 3/2022. I'd do it again. My wife got to hold her mother's hand while she peacefully died one morning instead of being separated from her as she died alone in a hospital from Covid (her doctors prediction given most people with ALS & dementia die of respiratory failure). We got our baby girl born without incident and thru her first autumn/winter flu/Covid season without incident, no small feat for a premier born to "geriatric" parents. We still have N95s for peaks locally and at my wife's work.

But none of that has anything to do with the dual tasks governments face. Or why one of the most conservative states in the Union saw it fit to pace a basic education course for ATVs. It's a deflection.
I mean this when I say this, I don’t give one flying phuk about people struggles with Covid not one little teeny tiny little ounce of a bit… You can judge me for that too.. and please do!!

I’ve seen the other side of Covid that people don’t talk about… Iv seen family’s Completely destroyed because of the misconception of COVID-19… All the suicides and mental health problems. The misunderstanding of science and statistics, and all the other bull$hit like it.. I don’t fear Death like I do slavery/imprisonment.

Sucks ANYTIME someone struggles for ANY REASON but, I’d be more pissed off at the Government for weaponization and propagating other people‘s ignorance with something scientifically proven as silly as COVID-19…
 

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Your ignorance is as profound for basic governance as it is for Covid and real science. Given your over reaction to a simple and minimally intrusive law like HB 180 I'm not shocked at all that you never learned the complicated reality of Covid but instead went down the rabbit hole you did. America made plenty of mistakes but Covid was anything but "silly" in how it killed more than a million Americans.

And your absence of basic human empathy is noted. We have a huge mess to clean up from Covid that will take a generation or more; that's as true for the way government over reacted as it is from it's under reactions. 2020 until this spring was an ugly mess. And tons of Americans are still recovering from those wide ranging experiences.

But then again, none of that is the topic at hand.

Best of luck. I think you are going to need it if this is your response to a mandated ATV certificate course. I don't recommend going to the DMV or Post Office anytime soon.
 

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Your ignorance is as profound for basic governance as it is for Covid and real science. Given your over reaction to a simple and minimally intrusive law like HB 180 I'm not shocked at all that you never learned the complicated reality of Covid but instead went down the rabbit hole you did. America made plenty of mistakes but Covid was anything but "silly" in how it killed more than a million Americans.

And your absence of basic human empathy is noted. We have a huge mess to clean up from Covid that will take a generation or more; that's true for the way government over reacted as it is from it's under reactions. 2020 until this spring was an ugly mess. And tons of Americans are still recovering from the experience.

Best of luck. I think you are going to need it if this is your response to a mandated ATV certificate course.

You know NOTHING about me buddy… see ya!
 

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Except of course the ideas you share here. Publicly and voluntarily. And ignorant is a fair descriptor for anyone that states a virus that killed one million Americans is "silly". Or that a 15 minute certificate course is "indoctrination".

*That and I can never unlearn that you thought of me while on the toilet. I've read some stuff on the internet before but that is one of the odder retorts to date. 🤷‍♂️😬
 

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Except of course the ideas you share here. Publicly and voluntarily. And ignorant is a fair descriptor for anyone that states a virus that killed one million Americans is "silly". Or that a 15 minute certificate course is "indoctrination".
Good God, you are Indoctrinated DEEP!!

A million deaths… phssss please… is that what they told you hu?

Oh $hit!! You changed my mind!!

My eyes have now been opened and I can thus see!!
 

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I was perusing the website more.

Anybody know more about the "Division of Outdoor Recreation" that was created this year? Appears mostly to be consolidation but are they going to be the hub for boating regulations as well now?

Seems to be the case to me.

They actually have a boater course I wasn't aware of. Might try to refresh myself on some of the content.

 
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