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Seems like a lot of scenarios could have happened here. I mean, a squatch could have bailed out of the tree above it and snapped it's neck and taken the backstraps and tenderloins leaving the rest to the scavengers!

I doubt that bull was poached. Very likely someone shot it / arrowed it, etc on an earlier hunt. We see a lot of long range heroes these days with all choice of weapons. Far too many game goes unrecovered. The beauty of the CWMU is that they don't allow you to keep hunting if blood is drawn, only the animal that was wounded. I know a lot of respectable hunters that live by this policy anyways but not all do. Very possible someone else found the carcass and walked out with the head in the dark. Especially if it was reasonably close to a road.

Nobody will likely ever know.
 

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Dude, without grazing on public lands you couldn't afford to buy a steak or burger in this country and removing cattle wouldn't add enough big game to make up the difference.
Prove it. Publicly grazed cattle are not the bulk (not even close) of cattle hitting the slaughter yards in the US. All types of publicly grazed livestock account for only 4% of the domestic supply. Economic considerations of livestock grazing on public lands in the United States of America

And the operation of the public grazing programs by USFS and BLM spends ~$3 to generate $1.
 

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All I know is this: the dead head rule was put into place because poachers (plural here not at all singular) were shooting animals and then retrieving them later as dead heads. That's why we have the law...and, with the amount of money antlers are worth these days, the practice could be rather profitable. So....go ahead say I am jumping to conclusions, but when I see an animal like the ones in the pics above, I suspect the worst.

BTW, johnnycake, the public grazing programs remind me of Milo Minderbinder's syndicate: the system that buys eggs for seven cents and sells them to the mess halls for five cents for a profit.
 

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Regarding the original post. I found a dead bull a bit further north in that area back in 2018 during the general season deer muzzy hunt. I immediately assumed a poacher, or someone plugged it, but it wasn't the trophy they wanted and left it without punching their tag. This bull is missing half its rack, and this was during the muzzy LE elk hunt. So I called DWR, cop hiked all the way in and took a look. Turns out it was gored by another bull. He lost a fight during the rut. It happens. Unfortunately, since the elk in the original post obviously died awhile ago, unless you find an arrow in it, or obvious signs someone took the backstraps or quaters, it's probably impossible to tell.
Dog Carnivore People in nature Fawn Plant
Wood Natural material Trunk Grass Terrestrial plant
 

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I know multiple people who have lost elk on that exact unit. One archer this year found his bull 2 weeks after the kill (roughly) and at least a week after the hunt ended.

Chances are it was a lost animal. Taking the head is illegal - but maybe they called the division and cleared it? Who knows (no one which is the point lol).
 

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Assuming the worst and allowing the DWR to investigate is best practice in my opinion. If they find that poaching was not the case, great. But, if they do suspect poaching, maybe they can find the culprit...
 

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And the operation of the public grazing programs by USFS and BLM spends ~$3 to generate $1.
Corn subsidies, dairy subsidies, e-vehicles subsidies, solar industry subsidies, etc, etc, etc. I'm good with subsidized grazing if it keeps cattle on the range and keeps ranches viable. Good people tied to the land and as sportsmen we are much better off with cows over cabins if the ranchers sale.
 

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Corn subsidies, dairy subsidies, e-vehicles subsidies, solar industry subsidies, etc, etc, etc. I'm good with subsidized grazing if it keeps cattle on the range and keeps ranches viable. Good people tied to the land and as sportsmen we are much better off with cows over cabins if the ranchers sale.
How do ranchers sell public land, exactly, since that is what we are talking about? “Private” lease grazing on public land.

It‘s inevitable that the leases will end and big cattle ranch operations using huge amounts of land will end. They cannot compete with feed lots on price. It’s just a matter of time before we “sportsman“ get fed up bumping elbows with other hunters on crowded public land.

Once the big operations end, no more will we have “ranchers” riding past our hunting camps in the middle of the night on ATV’s pushing elk into their “mostly” fenced in property.
 

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I thought it was only me and my brother that jumped to the worst possible scenarios?


Moose -- so, what did you shoot the cow with? Personally, I'm guessing that all that steel shot in your picture is just a cover. I'm pretty sure you're really shooting lead. Forget the DWR, I'm calling the Feds!!
She was shot with a 6.5 creedmoor
 

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How do ranchers sell public land, exactly, since that is what we are talking about? “Private” lease grazing on public land.

It‘s inevitable that the leases will end and big cattle ranch operations using huge amounts of land will end. They cannot compete with feed lots on price. It’s just a matter of time before we “sportsman“ get fed up bumping elbows with other hunters on crowded public land.

Once the big operations end, no more will we have “ranchers” riding past our hunting camps in the middle of the night on ATV’s pushing elk into their “mostly” fenced in property.
What a total load of Bull!!!! You ever tried herding cattle, much less WILD ELK???? I will go ahead and answer for you and say NO!!! Therefore you have zero idea what you are saying. 😂😂😂 herding elk after dark with four wheelers. Funny dude!!!!
 

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How do ranchers sell public land, exactly, since that is what we are talking about? “Private” lease grazing on public land.

It‘s inevitable that the leases will end and big cattle ranch operations using huge amounts of land will end. They cannot compete with feed lots on price. It’s just a matter of time before we “sportsman“ get fed up bumping elbows with other hunters on crowded public land.

Once the big operations end, no more will we have “ranchers” riding past our hunting camps in the middle of the night on ATV’s pushing elk into their “mostly” fenced in property.
You obviously have no idea on how it actually works. Grazing allotments do not restrict access for hunting. And feed lots are a finishing operation.
Ever think that those "ranchers" are required to move their livestock by certain dates? And just maybe it is not their only job?

My prediction is that the big operations will get bigger when you force others out and then you have even less influence than you have now. And the choices become to sell private land for development or mega corporations. What would you like to see?
 

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How do ranchers sell public land, exactly, since that is what we are talking about? “Private” lease grazing on public land.

It‘s inevitable that the leases will end and big cattle ranch operations using huge amounts of land will end. They cannot compete with feed lots on price. It’s just a matter of time before we “sportsman“ get fed up bumping elbows with other hunters on crowded public land.

Once the big operations end, no more will we have “ranchers” riding past our hunting camps in the middle of the night on ATV’s pushing elk into their “mostly” fenced in property.
Obviously you do not understand most ranches are combination of private owned and public leases. You might think when a ranch sales that the lease somehow is left open. Typically it's leased to new operator. Worst part is when cabins replace winter range and cabin owners lock out access to public lands.

CWMU program has opened vast tracks of Utah to public hunters and provide incentive to keep elk, deer on the private lands. Growing up in Utah we often were shocked when ranchers would ask DWR to cull elk out of haystacks during winter. Ranchers and sheepmen are mostly good people trying to make a living on lands they've loved for generations.
 

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What a total load of Bull!!!! You ever tried herding cattle, much less WILD ELK???? I will go ahead and answer for you and say NO!!! Therefore you have zero idea what you are saying. 😂😂😂 herding elk after dark with four wheelers. Funny dude!!!!
On this forum alone, there are many reports of this night time activity. And those reports are not by me. I suppose there are a lot of funny dudes, according to you.

You‘ve seen the facts, in this thread posted by others. Ranching on public land has outlived its usefulnes, mostly because it only accounts for 4% of beef sold. Public welfare for private ranchers will end.
 

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Ranchers have the right to do whatever they want on their private land.

Manage all public land for exclusively for public game, like elk and deer, and those herds will grow 10 fold from what they are today.

Managed exclusively for hunters paying fees for the privilege to hunt.

Were ranchers the original lobbyists, circa 1820?
 
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