Utah Wildlife Forum banner
1 - 20 of 32 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
580 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
While listening to the WB meeting and hearing all these commissioners from central utah complaining about elk... They should get a list and let the public hunters who apply for tags to hunt their property...

IMHO...If they would let us hunters on the property that is getting hit hard by elk they getting some hunters on them would push them back on the mountains...

Just thinking out loud.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,786 Posts
A bunch of bitchy individuals who believe they are owed everything when sportsmen are footing the major bill on public lands.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,440 Posts
Yup little girls. If they put half the effort into making there property less comfortable/accessible to elk. As they do whining and crying . They wouldn't have this problem
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,786 Posts
It just gets very frustrating especially watching these individuals walk to the mic and complain, complain, complain looking for a handout. Sportsmen have footed millions of dollars, done thousands of volunteered hours, dedicated hunter hours, paid license fees, heavy taxes, conservation stamps, and supported tons of great nonprofit organizations that continue to improve public lands and work with the BLM and Forest Service rather than against them, like ranchers and farmers have chosen, and they sit there and complain nonstop.

Maybe we should demand the fact that we foot the bill and manpower to improve these public lands and we want even more AMU's than cattle because they aren't doing a heck of a lot to improve public lands, so why are they dragging in success at bottom dollar grazing fees for the work and money we have put on the ground. Sportsmen don't want a war, and I'm not for us taking away from cattlemen because it is their lifestyle, but when they sit here and complain, and preach of no elk after we've spent millions upon millions to help our wildlife, lands, and elk, maybe they should get a war. Cattle eat far more than any deer, antelope, or elk could ever dream of, now maybe after we've done most the work, we decide if they are going to continue to complain, we decide we get most the benefit. We have both benefited from each other over the past few decades and it is more the farmer/rancher side of the argument that continues to not change, and they seem to not be able to see through their stubborn ways how much we have truly done for them. I'm sorry but those men who stood at the mic today are very clueless individuals, who aren't hoping for elk within management objectives but little to no elk at all. I won't stand for it and if they want push back they'll get it. Start working with us instead of against and stop being leeches on society hoping that everyone else spends the money and you reap all the benefits. Sportsmen had less elk, we decided instead of complaining constantly to raise the funds and grow our elk herds and help other wildlife as well. Farmers/ranchers seem to be in the norm of complaining and hoping the state will pay to fix their problems, whether by hay,fencing, manpower, etc. I understand it is their livelihood but if farmers are the hard working honest souls they claim to be stop trying to mooch off us and the state because you won't fix your own problems. Pay for your own fence sportsmen foot the bill for their projects. I pay plenty in donations, taxes, and fees year in and year out with the hopes we can reach objectives and move forward with wildlife and natural resources not backward. I'm willing to work with them to make things better for both sides, but not when they are continually working against us.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,786 Posts
Probably some type of federal aid available if they whine long enough. Same mold as the "kick-the-feds-out-of-Utah group. All's fine and dandy until a wildfire, drought, or predator does harm, then it's reach out to Uncle Sam and have him pay for it all.
Exactly. These good ole boys are supposed to be hard workers and the corner stone of America, not standing at a mic looking for a handout because you've done nothing to improve your situation or help yourself. Sportsmen foot the bill, and until farmers and ranchers start to foot some of it, they can shove their foot in their mouth. Anti-feds is on their objective, and yet they stand their in line for federal money for sprinkler systems and fencing, pathetic.
 
  • Like
Reactions: colbyatepaste

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,440 Posts
Hard to feel bad for a guy when he pulls up in a 70k truck. And claims poverty. Not all but some of these guys get away with to much. Wich I could care less untill they start bitching about the elk.most of my in laws are legit proud Cattlemen and know keeping elk off the fields the right way is part of the job
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,786 Posts
Hard to feel bad for a guy when he pulls up in a 70k truck. And claims poverty. Not all but some of these guys get away with to much. Wich I could care less untill they start bitching about the elk.most of my in laws are legit proud Cattlemen and know keeping elk off the fields the right way is part of the job
Hey those feds they're always bashing paid for their sprinkler lines and fencing around their property, they can afford a nice truck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
310 Posts
I have respect for the cattlemen and I sympathize with many of their complaints; however, their approach is currently to stick it to the hunters and take out the elk.

When I start seeing "no trespassing" signs turn into "elk hunters welcome with permission" I will take them serious.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
561 Posts
The reality is that they have created the problem and refuse to address it. They complain, the board listens, issues more permits, more public pressure pushes more and more elk onto their property. The next year they come back complaining even more elk...vicious cycle
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,786 Posts
The reality is that they have created the problem and refuse to address it. They complain, the board listens, issues more permits, more public pressure pushes more and more elk onto their property. The next year they come back complaining even more elk...vicious cycle
Very true and they just added a ton more pressure. If you allow hunters to push them off by hunting your problem would be solved and we wouldn't have to slaughter our cows .
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,825 Posts
I have respect for the cattlemen and I sympathize with many of their complaints; however, their approach is currently to stick it to the hunters and take out the elk.

When I start seeing "no trespassing" signs turn into "elk hunters welcome with permission" I will take them serious.
This is exactly how I feel. In most cases there's a solution. Have some hunters come and kill the elk. This will also not provide a safe haven for them. I realize that isn't the answer in every situation. But would work for many.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,128 Posts
Be like the Knuckle Head down South who went out and shot the hell outa them...These guys up North or any other area need to let these animals be harvested..just don't ask for the Title to their homes to obtain a permit.. FOR YOUR ELK HA!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,901 Posts
Another thing to note, many of the guys that run cattle don't do it on their own property. They are leasing the property to run cattle on and that's all.
They have no right or authority to let hunters on that land.
Then if the property owner is leasing the hunting rights to an outfitter who wants as many elk on the property as possible for his own clients to hunt.
Well, there lies a very big problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,825 Posts
Another thing to note, many of the guys that run cattle don't do it on their own property. They are leasing the property to run cattle on and that's all.
They have no right or authority to let hunters on that land.
Then if the property owner is leasing the hunting rights to an outfitter who wants as many elk on the property as possible for his own clients to hunt.
Well, there lies a very big problem.
Yeah, the land they are "leasing" is called national forest.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
580 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
All great points guys...

I think that if these county commissioners got a list of problem fields or Ranchers having issues the they could ask the division to get a list of problem fields that required the same permissions as Walk In Access Areas. Then that list could be used by hunters to focus there hunting pressure to help the elk be pushed off the land, and it would be help the Rancher / Landowner.

This just needs to be looked at as a Win / Win for all involved.

More could be done by both the Division and the County Commissioners. It just sucks that people wont reach out to help all, they would just like the easy road.

I wonder if we should get a letter out to Beaver, Wayne, Emery and other counties that were represented to the WB to get the information moving along?

Thoughts?
 

·
Member
Joined
·
1,666 Posts
Very true and they just added a ton more pressure. If you allow hunters to push them off by hunting your problem would be solved and we wouldn't have to slaughter our cows .
Yes, I can see this.

If I was a land owner, I think I would be hard pressed to allow hunters on my land.

Reason #1 - Littering

Reason #2 - Land Disturbance (ATV's, Tents, Trucks, Fire Puts, & Horses)

Reason #3 - You have something of value, why would you give it away for free.

I think you would be hard pressed for a land owner to find a hunter that doesn't disturb the land, litter, or pay a modest trespass fee.

Also, longer or spilt seasons would help control the pressure. August 1 - December 31 either open to all or split into weekly units would help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,786 Posts
Yes, I can see this.

If I was a land owner, I think I would be hard pressed to allow hunters on my land.

Reason #1 - Littering

Reason #2 - Land Disturbance (ATV's, Tents, Trucks, Fire Puts, & Horses)

Reason #3 - You have something of value, why would you give it away for free.

I think you would be hard pressed for a land owner to find a hunter that doesn't disturb the land, litter, or pay a modest trespass fee.

Also, longer or spilt seasons would help control the pressure. August 1 - December 31 either open to all or split into weekly units would help.
Why would they expect a trespass fee when they are the one doing nothing but whining about te elk? I would rather have less cow tags and not even get a tag than be slaughtering our cows. It's hypocritical to stand there and whine about them, then ask for a trespass fee. Their trespass fee is pushing te elk off their property and saving some of their hay they are taking so much of.

Also I think most of te farmers at the wildlife board meeting just had alfalfa fields the elk are on. They wouldn't need to allow anyone to camp or drive anywhere. If I were getting permission I would never expect that have me the right to drive on their property even to retreive game without asking, but yes there are those with bad habits that ruin it for us. I mean I would pay a trespass fee if it would get them off the elks back a little but I just don't see these ole boys changing their stubborn minds about them.
 
1 - 20 of 32 Posts
Top