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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I mean seriously this guy will have had 14 years worth of sitting in his comfy seat in this state and to do nothing but stab anyone who uses the outdoors in this state. It doesn't matter if you fish, hunt, camp, hike, bike, backpack, photograph, or simply enjoy our Utah landscapes this guy has got to go come the next election cycle in 2016. After his comments today over the sage grouse listing he has proven beyond any plausible doubt how disgusting of a human being he is. Get him out of office, stop voting for those not interested in any of what we hold important.
 

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Well what exactly did he saw. Don't paraphrase give the actual quote
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Here is his quote, he cannot call a win a win but can only find flaw in Washington, it just shows how petty and unwilling to work with he is:

"Do not be fooled. The announcement not to list the sage grouse is a cynical ploy," said Rep. Rob Bishop, R-Utah. "With the stroke of a pen, the Obama Administration's oppressive land management plan is the same as a listing. Now, successful conservation done at the state level will be in vain. The new command and control federal plan will not help the bird, but it will control the West, which is the real goal of the Obama Administration."
 

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Ok I will admit I am confused. What exactly did he say is wrong?
Did you want the sage grouse on the endangered list? Because that would cause all kinds of problems. Or was he wrong when he said Obama is trying to control the west with his land management plan?
Please enlighten me.
 

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Here is his quote, he cannot call a win a win but can only find flaw in Washington, it just shows how petty and unwilling to work with he is:
Well he could actually be right you know. Have you seen what the plan is the administration is putting forth? Is it contradictory to what Bishop is saying. Not saying he is wrong or right, I have no clue, but without knowing what the administration is wanting to do or is advocating it is impossible to tell if Bishop is actually right or wrong....unless I missed something.

Look I have no dog in this fight, I don't know Bishop from Adam and he's not my rep so all I really want is to find out the truth regardless of whether someone has a (D) or an (R) behind their political name
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
His whole issue with this subject is either way this went he found a way to criticize. Why can't he just deal with the fact the bird being listed was a win?

His issues are with the BLM/FS land management strategies for habitat with sage grouse in it. More basically though it is the same old "Washington can't manage our land like the state can" fight. He doesn't like the federal management plan for sage grouse habitat. But lets be honest that isn't the real fight he has. He simply wants the land turned over to the state. He's huge on development and oil and gas and if the plan doesn't completely favor those things, then he's going to have a problem with it. Their plan didn't give either side everything they wanted, and middle ground is where it should be.

The state should manage their parcels with their state management plan, and federal lands for the bird should be managed with federal plans. Should they work with one another? Yes, but how do you work with someone who can't work with you and won't compromise?

Here's the BLM plan if you care to look at it:
http://www.blm.gov/ut/st/en/prog/planning/SG_RMP_rev/deis.html
 

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So are you against the oil and gas industry. You know how many people in this state are employed by the oil and gas company's. As a whole they might have the largest voice as a group in this state.
By classifying the sage grouse as protected would impact thousands of jobs in the state of Utah.
 

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The sage grouse was not listed. Bishop is still complaining, even though he was crying about the danger of the bird being listed all along. I think that's the issue 1-I is talking about.

I can't say anything about any new federal land management plan for the west as I have not yet researched it enough to give a valid or educated opinion. However, the phraseology Bishop uses of Obama "controlling the west," seems to be mainly incendiary partisan rhetoric at first glance.
 

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As far as the oil and gas sector goes, I believe that oil and gas extraction are obviously necessities and provide many valuable jobs in our state.

However, the expansion of oil and gas production does not come without a very real social cost in many instances. Wild landscapes can be forever altered when new oil and gas production sites are created.

There is a balance to be found between energy development and preservation of wild areas and wildlife. Within our own state, there is not much governmental opposition to the oil and gas industry. Having some federal regulation and a plan for future oil and gas development is not the end of the industry, nor is it the end of the world.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
So are you against the oil and gas industry. You know how many people in this state are employed by the oil and gas company's. As a whole they might have the largest voice as a group in this state.
By classifying the sage grouse as protected would impact thousands of jobs in the state of Utah.
When did I say I was against oil and gas? I use it every day. There is a balance between sustaining these ecosystems and extracting these minerals though. Bishop is all about extraction and development, and let me say loud and clear NO I am not for extracting these resources however we want and at whatever cost necessary. There needs to be a plan of protection for the land these resources are extracted from and that is what the BLM has in place. Bishop simply doesn't like the fact the big bad BLM is imposing regulations on how it is done so he complains no matter what the outcome. He will complain until state has complete oversight over things and they have no consequences to destroying the land it comes from. I'm glad the BLM set in place a plan. It allows for extraction of these resources without destroying things like LEKs and doing these things in a way the land and habitat isn't neglected or forgotten about. Somewhere in the middle is where it needs to be, and Bishop only sees things through a narrow spectrum of all his way or he'll just keep complaining.
 

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He is nothing more than a political windbag hardly public enemy #1. He couldn't carry the Dons jock when it comes to threatening hunting priviledges and land privatization.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
He is nothing more than a political windbag hardly public enemy #1. He couldn't carry the Dons jock when it comes to threatening hunting priviledges and land privatization.
True, but he continues to make Utah and Utahns look like they support his thoughts on a national scale. I'm tired of the stupid things some of our representatives from Utah have to say constantly.
 

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I get where you are coming from but he doesn't support or represent me anymore than Obama does or ever will or Hillary does or ever will. Once people quit voting along party lines just because they think they are this or think they are that, things may change. I long considered myself republican until I opened my eyes. I try very hard to vote for those that represent me and my beliefs. More often than not that means that I would rather have democrats running the state and republicans running the federal government. Fact is the party system just needs to go. I would bet this guy would have bigger fish to fry if he wasn't just tooting his horn to look good and draw votes. He might actually get some work done. I doubt it but maybe.
 
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The Obama administration has no hidden agenda, management plan, or secret scheme to "take control of the West.
For lord sakes, will the fear mongering never stop!
As far as the Sage Grouse issue is concerned, the OFFICIAL Obama administration plan HAS BEEN ANNOUNCED...they are NOT going to list! Everyone wins with this decision.
 

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The Obama administration has no hidden agenda, management plan, or secret scheme to "take control of the West.
For lord sakes, will the fear mongering never stop!
As far as the Sage Grouse issue is concerned, the OFFICIAL Obama administration plan HAS BEEN ANNOUNCED...they are NOT going to list! Everyone wins with this decision.
I have not read a single post on this thread that claims that the Obama has a hidden agenda with regards to taking over the West. Where is this fear mongering in this thread that you speak of with Obama? WTH are you reading?
 

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I have not read a single post on this thread that claims that the Obama has a hidden agenda with regards to taking over the West. Where is this fear mongering in this thread that you speak of with Obama? WTH are you reading?
Mule. did you not read this:

"Do not be fooled. The announcement not to list the sage grouse is a cynical ploy," said Rep. Rob Bishop, R-Utah. "With the stroke of a pen, the Obama Administration's oppressive land management plan is the same as a listing. Now, successful conservation done at the state level will be in vain. The new command and control federal plan will not help the bird, but it will control the West, which is the real goal of the Obama Administration."

Please, please, someone...please post a link to this "Land Management Plan". Now not some link to Rush Limbprick or some other right right Obama hater, but a link to an official government sight or direct quote from President Obama explaining this Land Management Plan.
Oh gee, I forget, this, like all the other Obama plans to destroy America in general and the West in particular are all still a secret that Obama is going to just drop on us the last day of his term, it'll be to late to stop him then...oh, wow is me.
 

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my bad BP. I was stuck trying to find a comment from a forum member. My apologies.

From a political view I think a person that hunts, fishes and is concerned with ecology would be pretty hard pressed to side with the GOP when it comes to land conservation. When it comes to money and personal profits it is another story. I will be the first to admit that I can not stand Obama but when it comes to land conservation I will paint my face blue versus red any day of the week.
 
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Wow. Y'all are serious? If so, we're screwed.

So, if you're a pro-energy development hunter... how, exactly, does that work?

Right now, we're trying to salvage the Book Cliffs from Bishop's PLI. "Salvage" means protect the roadless area. We've been beaten back to that defensive line because the rest of the Books is gone in Bishop's proposal...gone to gas wells and Utah's first (not the last) tar sands open pit mine that just got the go-ahead to expand.

I get it. Some of you are city boys...hunting don't mean nothing more to you than a round of golf. Most certainly, Bishop's PLI allows for golf courses. Have at it.

For the rest of us, Bishop is the biggest threat to wildlife and public hunter access that we've seen in the past half-century. He's all about state control of public lands and he's a champion for energy development.

What's really weird is the fact that your Republican representatives don't like Bishop's PLI anyway. They object because it's a compromise.

But go ahead...vote for Bishop; vote that "R" ticket. But if that's your choice, don't count yourself as a conservationist and really, you aren't a big game hunter, either.
 

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Kwalk, muleskinner, and one eye all gave good measured responses that were tempered, well thought out and I mostly agree with. I am thinking Finnegan must paddle a canoe to work every morning to go check his trap line along the Jordan river, lord knows the man doesn't burn a drop of satan's oil & gas. Also didn't know wildlife on the book cliffs were only present in the roadless area--have heard different.

Any-who, I don't support blow hard bishops nor the Edward Abbey groupies, I like to drive down the middle of the road and veer a little left sometimes and a little right sometimes, but mostly stay in the middle--it keeps me out of the ditch. :grin:
 
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