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Hey all you wise cattlemen that showed up at the April meeting, have you noticed yet we still haven't dried out? Those wise old boys that know so much and jumped on our elk herd before the August meeting can eat their words. That "serious" drouth we were in kind of got washed away by nearly a good storm per week all summer.

I know know,I should get over it already. But with a storm in the forecast for tomorrow and next week, those that said wait to make the decision were about, 100% right. Maybe next year those smarter than the rest of us good ole boys should be told to shove it before we agree to slaughter our elk herd again.
 

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spell check, aisle 3
 
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Discussion Starter #3
I apologize
 

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1 eye, you sure can come up with some really stupid statements.

How full are most of our reservoirs right now?

What is the fuel load moisture percentages of most the brush and timber in our mountains right now?

Last time I checked, fire dangers were high to extreme across the state.

Is that because things are a little dryer out there than they may appear?
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
You know ridge I knew I would get that response. I don't know a deer or an elk who give a **** what percentage our reservoirs are at. That tends to be a problem we have, not a problem wildlife have. We have gotten rain almost the entire summer with the exception of a 2 week period. Things on the mountain are greener than I've ever seen them at the end of July. And yes Piute reservoir is projected to be empty by the end of the season, but I don't know that the deer and elk are panicking over it much. Of course fire danger is high, by this point it's high every year, it only takes a few hundred degree days to dry the soil out, but we have for some reason got storm after storm this year at the most opportune times. We haven't had any significant dry periods since May. Grass is high and green. Cheat grass is high fire danger hours after a good rain storm, of course there's fire danger. But to act as though we haven't had very favorable conditions for or elk and deer is asinine.

Winter snowpack means a lot more to us than our wildlife. As long as the moisture comes in some form, wildlife will be okay. It is us who suffer from low snowpacks.
 

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"drouth" is actually the Scottish version, or poetic version of the word drought. I would expect nothing less from a highlander like 1-I.-----SS
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Maybe it's just me... But I feel like mocking the cattle ranchers and land owners is a bad move for an outdoorsman.
Not after how they acted at the last wildlife board meeting. They are welfare farmers who ride on our tax dollars to sustain their business, and then complain about wildlife that can actually pay for themselves. Not to mention that sportsmen are doing 90% of the on the ground work on public land. So they whined enough to get hundreds of more cow tags than needed to be released at too early of a date to determine what the range would look like at this point. If they're going to act like that, then they deserve some push back. A good relationship starts with BOTH sides being decent to work with. Sportsmen are the ones who got the extremely short end of the stick off those decisions. The side doing all the work shouldn't be the side getting screwed. I don't have a problem with cattlemen who are reasonable, I do have a problem with the welfare cattlemen in this state who think they're side is the only important side. It doesn't matter if we're mocking them... They're going to complain and claim poverty either way. Wonder how being so poor they bought that $60,000 truck, strange...Again a rant I've made many times, sorry.

And to explain myself better. No I don't think we are out of the woodwork, but August 26th was a much better time to make the decision on cows, when we knew what our lands looked like at that point.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
"drouth" is actually the Scottish version, or poetic version of the word drought. I would expect nothing less from a highlander like 1-I.-----SS
Just wanted to be like my "high class" friends who showed up at the board meeting.
 

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Maybe it's just me... But I feel like mocking the cattle ranchers and land owners is a bad move for an outdoorsman.
Their interests are not my interests. And unless you are a cattle rancher, they are not looking out for your interests either. There are some very good, responsible landowners and ranchers out there. I don't mean to paint with too broad of a brush. But make no mistake, they will (and have) slit the throat of sportsmen in a second to benefit for their own agendas.

I understand there should be a give and take relationship here. But they way it is now, where they constantly take and the public constantly gives, is not what I'm talking about with "give and take."
 

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And its not just public land. My father recently relayed a story about some ranchers pushing their cattle across our property. That in and of its self is not a big deal, but they were rude, and would not even talk to him when they were approached. We are in a position to essentially cut off access to part of their FS allotment if we cattle guard the road and fence the property, which is looking like the thing to do right now. I don't mind a few cows, but 50 poaching off of me is BS. It is just like has been said, they are welfare queens, and they should be treated as such. I have no doubt they are over their allotment this year as well.

These particular guys have some of their property enrolled in a CWMU along with some other property owners near us. So I can't hunt their property, but they think its alright to poach their cows on mine? And this is not isolated, I've dealt with it in other places as well. That is unfortunately the mentality of many of these guys.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I don't know if I mentioned yet how stupid those good ole boys look yet, here's another post to rub it in, shouldn't have put our elk herd in the hands of selfish fools. 2 storms last week, a storm the week before that and now here's the forecast, the meeting we asked to wait for to decide tag numbers is a week and a half away:
 

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I don't know if I mentioned yet how stupid those good ole boys look yet, here's another post to rub it in, shouldn't have put our elk herd in the hands of selfish fools. 2 storms last week, a storm the week before that and now here's the forecast, the meeting we asked to wait for to decide tag numbers is a week and a half away:
I just thought how shocking it was by how quickly the wildlife board moves on a decision and the numbers as well. That meeting I watched was pretty embarrassing. Also, I have no sympathy for those ranchers. They cry about elk but guess what happens when you ask them to hunt their property? Show me the money!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I just thought how shocking it was by how quickly the wildlife board moves on a decision and the numbers as well. That meeting I watched was pretty embarrassing. Also, I have no sympathy for those ranchers. They cry about elk but guess what happens when you ask them to hunt their property? Show me the money!
The problem was the only ones who showed up at the meeting and made a fuss were the welfare ranchers, SFW is who we had sticking up for us and that's it, yeah that's how embarrassing the meeting was. I suggest sportsmen flood the wildlife boards emails and show up to this next meeting if possible. They need to realize we aren't going to foot a giant bill to improve lands, pay depredation fees, do the labor, install water sources, and still get screwed in the end. How many ranchers do you think have walked and fixed fences to keep the elk and cows on the aspen regeneration project? I think none would be a fair estimate, but plenty of dedicated hunters have. It's a complete disgrace what happened at the meeting and where we are now, I would put pressure on the board to not do this, or to at least not be so easily swayed.
 

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The problem was the only ones who showed up at the meeting and made a fuss were the welfare ranchers, SFW is who we had sticking up for us and that's it, yeah that's how embarrassing the meeting was. I suggest sportsmen flood the wildlife boards emails and show up to this next meeting if possible. They need to realize we aren't going to foot a giant bill to improve lands, pay depredation fees, do the labor, install water sources, and still get screwed in the end. How many ranchers do you think have walked and fixed fences to keep the elk and cows on the aspen regeneration project? I think none would be a fair estimate, but plenty of dedicated hunters have. It's a complete disgrace what happened at the meeting and where we are now, I would put pressure on the board to not do this, or to at least not be so easily swayed.
showing up isn't the issue. Having a person who can/will write a personal check in the hundreds of thousands of dollar range on behalf of the average joe is what's needed. Average Sportsman as a whole contribute the most money but that sorta money isn't the kind that can grease the palms of those in charge.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
showing up isn't the issue. Having a person who can/will write a personal check in the hundreds of thousands of dollar range on behalf of the average joe is what's needed. Average Sportsman as a whole contribute the most money but that sorta money isn't the kind that can grease the palms of those in charge.
I can agree with that, but I think pressuring them with enough pushback will show we aren't the crowd that's going to be stabbed in the back and pushed around over and over again without giving them something to think about. Average sportsmen, even $FW stepped to the plate (and they do write big checks;-)) and said to not jump ahead of ourselves and release all these pronghorn and cow tags before we saw what the weather was going to do. They jumped down our throats and nothing was done to consider our interests, funds, or work at that meeting, and I'm still fuming over it if you can't tell. This has nothing to do with taking cow and tags out of people's pockets, it has to do with the fact the works, money, and time spent in our wildlife is being discounted by a few welfare farmers who think they are owed the world and everything in it.
 

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Wait a minute guys. Maybe we should rethink our ways. Did you see that 4 guys on the internet are "pushing back".

So your pissed ranchers want us to kill elk?

Would it be better if we had an option 2 for elk?

Down in fishlake the FS has just as big of a bonner for elk as ranchers.

Let's start a rant about that.

Stupid aspen anyway!
 
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